The "What Did You Just Do In NoLimits" Thread
I have over 15,260 track connecters and pieces of custom wooden beams put in so far for this scenic railway coaster.
Technically I didn't do anything but here's a little video I made for Hypersonic XLC MkII, an old project of COASTERGUY246's. Kind of like a tech demo for RU250, I'm learning premier a bit better with this video.
I call them Block Blocks!
Looks a lil bit mysterious ....
bestdani, you really is da best!
Color me both intrigued and willing to download immediately after release.
Wonder if this will inspire another 'spur of the moment' creation that I'm not specifically planning right now.
Actually this all isn't so much about what I have done: Three new things...
Looks like a TV screen.
Need to work on return to FBR, but:
that layout's too predictable & repetitive
Without saying it like an asshole, I like the layout and the shaping seems really solid, but I feel like it kind of repeats itself a little too much, maybe try to vary everything after the first loop a little bit more. I like the direction it's headed though, just maybe try to work in some more elements seen on new gen Inverts.
I mean I don't love or hate it, but I don't really find it any more predictable than something like Banshee. Maybe use some of the new wingriders as inspiration if you want something more unique? If not really I think it works ok.
I think what people are trying to say is that there are a lot of similar elements grouped together without having some sort of variation in between. Yes, B&M does this throughout their history, but one newer exceptions that flows really well is Oz'Iris. If you look at the layout, you can see that most of the inversions are separated by other elements that feel inherently different. The reason why they feel different is because of the variation in speed at the peak of each element. The dive loop, which slows down heavily at the top, is contrasted by the faster overbank right after it. After the next two inversions, the second overbank slows down heavily, which is then contrasted by a tunnel (which makes riders think they're going faster than they are) and a whippy, fast corkscrew, which is THEN contrasted by the next helix which allows riders to slow down and catch their breath.
With this in mind, we can make five changes (add, replace, lower, switch, modify) to add variation while keeping the main idea of a "Large New-Gen B&M Invert a la Banshee." I love the first two inversions since they contrast each other nicely already. If you can add a low overbank between them, it would highlight this contrast even more. The next inversion, however, feels repetitive after the immelman-dive loop combination since the riders technically just rode through two halves of a loop. I would replace it with a fast zero-g roll that's snappy and rotates counter-clockwise to flow into the next section. The turnaround afterwards is a cool element, but it still slows down at it's peak just like the first three inversions. Lowering it's height would solve this issue, and I believe that if there was one change that could fix the "repetitiveness" complaints it would be this one. Now, for the next two elements, we can just switch them. I would have the loop come first, as it is as contrasted as you can get from the low-to-the-ground turn that precedes it. Next comes the speed bump and the other zero-g roll. These three elements, in this order, would have the same feel as Silver Bullet's or Phaethon's last two corkscrews, which is one of my favorite sequences B&M has done. The last helix is nice, but just as a style thing I would modify the entrance to the element start on the perimeter of the helix rather than running through the center. This last change is not in the vein of making the layout more varied, but if I'm going to critique I'm going to critique.
That all being said, your shaping and the technicality of the coaster is amazing, and I'm surprised that wasn't the first thing mentioned. I'm sorry for the long post, but I felt like being told that the layout is predictable and to vary it up is way too vague, and that this coaster has too much potential to be the brunt of vague critique.
I appreciate all the feedback, especially kryptos's detailed post. There were a few things I should maybe list to help you all better understand what I was trying to do with it:
_Hyper class Invert
+Blend B&M Invert content with that of B&M Hyper attributes:
%Height
%Long bouts of sustained Normal G forces
%Large and tall elements
As well as
%Tight inversions
%Medium-Fast pace
%High physical intensity
Keeping this in mind, I choreographed the layout at the start to push as much high normal G force onto riders as possible before overdoing it. This is why you see the long banked valleys, large immel and dive tie up and large loop. This is all done without a break, and every valley sustains almost 3.5-3.75g force for their whole duration. So, to ease off the riders and offer them a break, I added the tall/swooping easy bank to bank element that relaxed to 1.5 normal G force. The helix rides around 3g, so easier forces than just experienced. With the rides reduced speed, I finished the layout with snappier, tighter Invert elements known for the standard class, as well as a high G helix finale, though with a smoother, eased 1.5 normal G finish; more familiar to a new Gen B&M.
I know the layout isn't perfect, but I figured Id share my intentions. If any of you are familiar with banshee or some of the new long trained B&M hypers, I'd suggest rewatching the POV and trying to imagine how your body and mind would feel under the duress of these sustained forces and reevaluate your feelings towards it. That's how I think when I FVD my rides.
On the other hand, I woke up thinking about inverts and had some time between noon and 4 to do something. Meaning it was a single run kinda thing without too much alternative consideration.
^I'm a composer, and I can tell you that the worst thing you can do for anything you've created is get married to your first idea and attempt to justify criticism as "I should explain what I ACTUALLY mean." It takes work to get to that point, and regardless of the layout, which for the first three elements is one of the strongest and most realistic B&M mega-invert layouts I've seen, don't be afraid to start from scratch. I have a folder specifically for older versions of my rides to go and combine multiple features that I've enjoyed while still allowing myself to make drastic edits to the overall layout.
TL;DR -- Don't deflect constructive criticism by attempting to explain your reasoning.
tcninja, I think it's fair to say what he's going for. I did it all the time with coaster design, but I'd also consider all feedback I received, see where they were coming from. Then I'd think of how I can incorporate the thoughts if I agreed, and if not it might just be something to keep in mind. It worked really well and I've gotten plenty of high ratings and appreciation from my work.
With that said, I also think your entire post is great advice.
^^ I definitely am not totally married to the current layout. I mostly just wanted to demonstrate the original thought process that went into it, as well as the fact that there was one. Also, thanks for the compliment on the early part of the ride; that's what I was most proud of.
^ Absolutely. I want people to see where I'm coming from, but I consider all perspectives and criticisms.
Also, I'd like to hear what you all think of the revisions:
I kept the original early parts of the ride, even though it wasn't everyone's favorite.
I made this Intamin (Kinda more like Mack) Multi Launch
Video:
^If that wasn't in the "WDYJD" thread, I would have assumed that's real.
Also, something that I'm deliberately distracting myself from because I'd rather use the RMC update when that comes out, but since this is far from finished and I don't have a sequence of elements or layout nailed down yet, I believe that's entirely feasible.
A spinning coaster with some fun elements, like a launch and tilttracks
Soko. In the nicest way possible. That drop is one of the most disgusting things you've ever posted. What happened man, who hurt you?
That was sufficient info to find what's wrong and how to fix it. Thanks.
To interpret what he meant to say, the drop could be improved with two things in mind: meandering and inflection points. First thing's first, there is a lot of track in that predrop. RMC usually does not take their sweet time; they immediately start the action. Outlaw Run is the closest to having a similar element, and it is a very quick element used to get the riders' attentions before the main event. The drop in the picture looks like it is just there to get from Point A to Point B, but if you were to design it with some sharper radii and some fun lats it would be an exciting way to sucker punch riders before landing a satisfying haymaker with the drop.
The second idea has to do with the actual drop itself. From this angle, it looks like the drop gets steep really fast, then stays near vertical for quite some time while not changing the radius as much. Even though 90 degree drops are fun, there's a reason why a hyper coaster drop feels much different than a drop tower. Drops are exciting not because of their steepness but because of the g-forces applied to riders throughout the whole element. This is where the inflection point, or where the coaster track changes concavity, comes in. It is very obvious where Steel Vengeance's inflection point is, less so for your KI 2020 RMC. A nice real-world example of a ride with no clear inflection point is Phantom Revenge's second drop. While it is really fun, once you hit the maximum steepness you are basically just sitting there waiting for the pullout. Focusing on defining a clear inflection point will make sure that your riders are on the edge of their seat, literally, as they go down your first drop.
Like always, my critique (and anyone else's) can be taken and done with as you wish. If what anyone says about your coaster is not within the lines of your original vision, you are more than welcome to discard it. From what I can tell, FOF and Banshee look really nice as well and I look forward to seeing the rest of the coaster.
Kryptos posted on September 29th, 2018
Outlaw Run is the closest to having a similar element, and it is a very quick element used to get the riders' attentions before the main event.
I think the original idea was for more like Outlaw Run but for some reason turned it into what I had in the picture. No reason I couldn't turn it back how it was before.
Kryptos posted on September 29th, 2018
KI 2020 RMC.
When I make (or start to make) something for a park, it's usually more about what I'd like to see while keeping some parameters in mind than an actual prediction.
Kryptos posted on September 29th, 2018
and Banshee look really nice as well
Just between you and me, that's because it's in the BG and I was too lazy to make a good full-on recreation. Same with Racer.
Very nice POV, looks pretty accurate. Very smooth, nice music !!!